(Update I below)
Disclaimer: I would like to point out that the views expressed below are mine alone and do not necessarily represent or reflect the official views of LoonWatch or any of its writers aside from myself (Danios).
Salon’s indefatigable Glenn Greenwald recently wrote (emphasis added):
Worship of the American military and all that it does — and a corresponding taboo on speaking ill of it except for tactical critiques (it would be better if they purchased this other weapon system or fought this war a bit differently) – is the closest thing America has to a national religion.
If worship of the military is America’s national religion, then the U.S. soldier is this religion’s holy warrior. Greenwald noted that the Navy Seals are “a member of the most sacred and revered religious order.” Those who die in “the line of duty” are martyrs who must be remembered for all “they have done for this country.” Any criticism against the rank-and-file holy warrior is considered blasphemous.
There can be no possible profession that is more highly praiseworthy to the American than soldier in the military. Many U.S. airlines will let soldiers board the plane even before women with children and the disabled. Being part of the war machine is more respectable than being a doctor, a social worker, a teacher for the disabled, or a volunteer at the local orphanage. Saving people (what a physician does) can in no way, shape, or form be considered better than killing people (what a soldier does).
A person foolish enough to say that “a soldier kills people” will be beaten into submission and subservience by jingoist mantras such as “you should be thankful that you are able to express such views, because it is only due to the sacrifices of those in uniform–who protect your freedoms–that you are free to say what you want.” This, even though no rational mind could possibly believe this: how does bombing, invading, and occupying Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan, or Yemen “protect my freedoms?” That is, unless one is naive enough to think that any of these Evil, Foreign Brown People were about to conquer the United States, topple its government, and take away my freedoms.
In any case, I have my own government to do that for me. Far from “fighting for my freedoms,” the military-industrial complex and those in authority who wage these wars are responsible for clamping down on my civil liberties. With the rise of the Orwellian-named Patriot Act and its like, there has been a sustained war waged not just against Al-Qaeda but against civil liberties, with dedicated assaults on the First and Fourth Amendments.
Worship of the military and the holy warrior runs so deep that even the most ardent critic of the war must never utter a single word against those who wage it. Such a common sense thing to do is completely off-limits and beyond the scope of decency and propriety. To do so would be to open oneself up to the criticisms of being “unpatriotic” and “disloyal.” Criticism of the war must be couched in “patriotic language:” war critics must ceremoniously acknowledge their support for U.S. troops, arguing that I support the troops which is why I want to bring them home. It is simply unacceptable to just clearly say: I don’t support the troops because they are shooting at, bombing, and killing people. To do such a thing would be to commit the highest of sins in the American national religion.
The fact that even war critics would hush you up for saying something against America’s cherished holy warriors says something of how deeply ingrained militarism is in our society. How can it be that opponents of America’s wars will criticize the war as unjust on the one hand but not be anything but absolutely reverent towards those who wage it? The United States, after all, uses an all-volunteer military; by joining the military is not one making an active choice to take part in these unjust wars? And certainly, one can choose not to fight, as many brave soldiers and ex-soldiers have done.
Noting with what absolute reverence Americans speak of their soldiers of war, one wonders how it is that they are simultaneously amazed at how unbelievably warlike those Foreign, Other People are for revering their own men of war. We are taken aback by how “primitive” the North Koreans are when they mindlessly revere their soldiers, yet somehow mystified when we do the same with our troops. The North Korean soldiers have certainly killed far fewer and waged far fewer wars than our own military. But alas, those North Koreans are so primitive, whereas we are so advanced, civilized, and peaceful.
I don’t malign or vilify soldiers in the military (as I partially do accept the idea that “they are just doing their job”), but must we continue to speak of our holy warriors with such absolute reverence, awe, and worship? Our mindless idolization of the military profession is what is to blame for so many of our impressionable youth choosing to join the military to kill people abroad instead of spending those years going to college to expand their minds. Placing the military and its soldiers on a pedestal is the only way a society can convince its young boys to risk their lives to go to war for the country–something so illogical, so contrary to the biological drive to save oneself from harm or death, that absent the most compelling of reasons one can hardly find it worthwhile to do so.
Interestingly, even that religious and ethnic minority that is the target of America’s wars is itself affected by this national religion. Muslim-Americans will often bend over backwards to point out that they too “proudly serve this country” by being a part of the military. (Even the phrase “serve this country” can only mean one thing: soldiering.) In order to be accepted as Full Citizens, Muslim-Americans must prove their dedication to America’s war machine.
And so, Muslim-Americans–many of them immigrants or children of immigrants–beg to be included in the same institution that wages endless wars in their ancestral homelands. It is that same institution that is rife with racism and bigotry against Arabs and Muslims, yet so desperately do Muslim-Americans want to be included in it.
* * * * *
In this national religion, 9/11 is America’s Karbala. The Battle of Karbala involved the slaughter of the Prophet Muhammad’s descendants by a tyrannical government–an event that is religiously commemorated each year by Shia Muslims, who will often make a religious pilgrimage (ziyarat) to the site of the battle or to the graves of the victims. With vigor just short of this, Americans commemorate Patriot Day, the holy day of the American national religion.
Ground Zero, meanwhile, is the “hallowed ground”–a trip here is the ziyarat (religious pilgrimage) of the American religion. The American flag becomes a symbol not to be disrespected, our nation’s holy book, waved high by people chanting “USA! USA! USA!”, which can only mean one thing: war! The flag has become a raised symbol of war.
The military is our national religion, its soldiers are our holy warriors, the Navy Seals are our highest religious order, those soldiers who died in war are our martyrs, 9/11 was our Karbala, Patriot Day is our annual holy day, the flag is our holy book and symbol, Osama bin Laden is Lucifer, Terrorism is the greatest Evil, supporting the troops is our greatest religious obligation, and failure to do so is the greatest blasphemy and the highest of sins.
* * * * *
The problem I have with the cult-like remembrance of 9/11 is that it was the devotion to this day that was used to launch wars of vengeance that killed ten times as many people. This date, 9/11, has been militarized. It is a memory we are told that we must never forget lest we slacken in our resolve to wage war against the Forces of Evil, the Satan of our religion: radical Islam and Terrorism. It is a memory that is invoked to remind the American people why they need to spend more of their taxpayer money to sustain their country’s illegal occupations and immoral wars.
Furthermore, the singling out of this day above all others (including days on which worse acts of violence were perpetrated by the United States), exudes the tribalistic mentality that infects people with strong feelings of national or religious identity–wherein only blood shed against one’s own national or religious group is remembered (and in fact, it is obsessed over), whereas that shed by one’s own national or religious group against others is ignored, denied, or justified.
Lastly, one cannot help but feel that 9/11 would hardly have been considered as important to the national religion had it not been Muslims who were implicated in the attack. They attacked us. The deaths of the victims of 9/11 are less relevant than the fact that they–those Foreign, Dark-Complexioned Moozlums–are the ones who caused these deaths. The horrendous attacks of 9/11 have special significance due to the fact that the perpetrators were radical Muslims, an Existential Threat to our Safety and Freedoms.
The victims of 9/11 certainly ought to be remembered, as should all the victims of war and terrorism (whether the culprit be our enemies or our own country and whether the victims be American or not), but should their memory really be exploited to feed the national religion of warmongering? Is it not deeply disturbing that an act of violence and the deaths of three-thousand innocents are being used to justify even greater acts of violence and even more civilian deaths?
Disclaimer: I would like to point out that the views expressed above are mine alone and do not necessarily represent or reflect the official views of LoonWatch or any of its writers aside from myself (Danios).
Update I: An interesting Facebook status that is making the rounds:
On 9/11, I’ll mourn the nearly 3,000 lives lost, over 6,000 injuries, the infrastructural carnage and devastation in NYC, and the humiliation of my country, all perpetrated ignorantly in the name of my religion
On 9/12, I’ll mourn the nearly 1,000,000 lives, the 10′s of millions of injuries, the infrastructural decimation in 3 countries, and the humiliation of my religion, all perpetrated ignorantly in the name of my country.
Update II: Many readers and fellow LoonWatch writers have pointed out that many young people join the military due to financial reasons. Additionally, many of them are “trying to serve their country” and “are just following orders.” I do not completely disagree with these statements. As I said, I do not malign or vilify soldiers, nor encourage that. What I am opposed to is the glorification of what they do.
September 11th, 2011 at 5:26 pm
Shame on you. How dare you have the temerity to question America’s, sorry, God’s honest truth.
September 11th, 2011 at 6:38 pm
Remember the Japanese Co-prosperity sphere?
September 11th, 2011 at 7:21 pm
I actually do respect the military(though not those who do wrong, and I tend to not be anti authority, but I thank you for letting people such as myself talk and be educated on this forum. I hope you realise that not all military members get their thrills killing innocent people, and there are those who did want to help. Again, thank you for letting me express my views, even if you do not agree with me.
September 11th, 2011 at 7:27 pm
@ Mindy:
The fundamental issue is this: The military men, every single one of them that has been deployed, are taking part in an occupation.
The occupation is unjust. Being a part of the occupation must also then be unjust. So, why would you give “respect” to someone who is a part of it?
You say that you give your respect to those soldiers “except those who do wrong,” but isn’t being a part of an occupation force fit the definition of “doing wrong?”
You might say that they really “want to help,” but then they are guilty of naivety and ignorance. Does that warrant your respect?
September 11th, 2011 at 7:37 pm
Wow, Danios you put into words what I have been feeling for these past couple of days. It is exactly for this reason that I turned off my TV last Monday and will not turn it on until October. I work at Health retail store and today my Non Muslim white coworkers were complaining about the coverage of the anniversary. The older lady coworker said that the news coverage on the days following 9/11 in 2001 caused her to unplug her TV and it has been unplugged till now. She said: “Its like they are trying to shove it down your throat or pound it into your head” The younger Coworker who is 25 was very frustrated and couldn’t understand why the hell people in the news kept repeating the same clips of the towers and smoke and asking stupid questions during the interviews. In all honesty I was afraid to say anything, not because my coworkers were bad people, but because I was afraid of being blamed or labelled as “supportive of terror”. A bit on Muslims and Arabs joining the Military; I know two Muslim Arabs living in my neighborhood who joined the Military, one went to Iraq, the other didn’t, and just recently my cousin moved to Alabama and has joined the marines.
September 11th, 2011 at 7:42 pm
Danios, it was very brave of you to write this article. However, I do agree with Mindy that servicemen deserve respect—at least lip service. Even many prominent Muslims who have written articles about 9/11’s tenth anniversary voiced their sympathies with the military—if not its leaders’ action, at least with those who volunteer themselves.
September 11th, 2011 at 7:43 pm
@ Nassir:
Even many prominent Muslims who have written articles about 9/11’s tenth anniversary voiced their sympathies with the military—if not its leaders’ action, at least with those who volunteer themselves.
My view on this was reflected in the article: “Interestingly, even that religious and ethnic minority that is the target of America’s wars is itself affected by this national religion…”
September 11th, 2011 at 7:46 pm
I agree wholeheartedly. Last year, I boycotted my dance studio for 3 months because they kept harassing me about being in a “Dance for the Troops” event. They would not take “no” for answer because everyone MUST “support” the troops. I wrote them a long letter, and though it was not as eloquent, it expressed some of the same ideas as Danios’ post.
I believe that I do support the troops…by refusing to celebrate war, and by protesting when we send them to kill and be killed under false pretenses. My boycott didn’t make me popular with some of my peers at the dance studio, but some later told me they were persuaded by my arguments.
As for 9/11, it should be a somber remembrance for those who were killed, and maybe a reflection on what it’s like for people in other countries when they are the receiving end of our own bombing campaigns. Maybe then it could inspire peace and understanding, instead of vengeance and warfare.
September 11th, 2011 at 7:50 pm
@Danios, by “doing wrong” I was saying how I disagreed with those soldiers who have have been charged with abuse or worse. I do not support the people who do things like that, but I also read about a group of Marines and Navy corpsmen who helped arrange for a kid with a birth defect to get surgery here in the U.S., and I support the ones like them who try to help and make the best out of a bad situation.
September 11th, 2011 at 7:55 pm
Excellent piece. I have long challenged the notion that “our boys” are giving their lives to “defend us” or have made the ultimate sacrifice to “defend democracy.” We have shredded democracy, so whatever the hell the servicemen are doing most accurately falls into the category of murdering civilians along with the enemy, or being the hired muscle for dubious foreign policy goals. But this piece of yours puts it in a more complete framework. Yes, these soldiers are holy warriors. And one could even call them Crusaders.
September 11th, 2011 at 7:58 pm
Most these guys dont join to take part in a occupation they join to serve there country ( ok some did join after 9/11 for revenge but that is small %) if we should be mad at people for occupation it should be Bush Dick and rest of politicians that choose this war when they know it was all BS and are now at home sleeping safe.
2.They are following orders what ever they may be right ( food drops to Somalia) or wrong ( invading a country like Iraq) not there choice …. They can’t refuse because the way military works is They refuse they go to jail or get dishonor discharged and that stay on your record and goes with you when you look for work every application that is on the bottom were you in the military were u dishonor discharged so they can’t just say no They also sign contracts 4 years so they cant just quit …..
3.You are right there is a diffrence between hero worship and being above everything and can’t do wrong like we Americans do and respect You respect them for going a job no one wants to do not or wants to do but must be done like Cops or Firefighters and thank them but that about it.
I think this all started after Nam and how we treated these kids when they came back they like today went to over there because of stupid politicians and took bullets and then were treated like crap when they came back
September 11th, 2011 at 8:12 pm
@ Mindy:
I also read about a group of Marines and Navy corpsmen who helped arrange for a kid with a birth defect to get surgery here in the U.S
And yet they did this simultaneously (and on a far greater scale):
Huge rise in birth defects in Falluja
September 11th, 2011 at 8:19 pm
Adolf Hitler was a soldier in WW1. In WW2 when someone complained about losing too many young German soldiers the fuhrer said “That’s what they are there for”. Unfortunately soldiers of the armed forces everywhere can become victims of the deviousness of their own leaders and their foreign policy or bad management. I blame the leaders not the soldiers.
September 11th, 2011 at 8:42 pm
I think the substance of your entire article can be distilled to one sentence:
The American flag becomes a symbol not to be disrespected, our nation’s holy book, waved high by people chanting “USA! USA! USA!”, which can only mean one thing: war! The flag has become a raised symbol of war.
The reader can decide if the unrecognizable intellectual process you used to arrive at your conclusion will make the rest of the article worth reading.
September 11th, 2011 at 8:49 pm
@ Farlowe:
As I said, one does not need to vilify or malign the soldiers. But why the reverential awe and respect towards them?
September 11th, 2011 at 8:58 pm
@ Farlowe
Now, there’s one thing you might have noticed I don’t complain about: politicians. Everybody complains about politicians. Everybody says they suck. Well, where do people think these politicians come from? They don’t fall out of the sky. They don’t pass through a membrane from another reality. They come from American parents and American families, American homes, American schools, American churches, American businesses and American universities, and they are elected by American citizens. This is the best we can do folks. This is what we have to offer. It’s what our system produces: Garbage in, garbage out. If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you’re going to get selfish, ignorant leaders. Term limits ain’t going to do any good; you’re just going to end up with a brand new bunch of selfish, ignorant Americans. So, maybe, maybe, maybe, it’s not the politicians who suck. Maybe something else sucks around here… like, the public. Yeah, the public sucks. There’s a nice campaign slogan for somebody: ‘The Public Sucks
George Carlin
September 11th, 2011 at 9:02 pm
“I think the substance of your entire article can be distilled to one sentence…”
And I think you’re JihadBob under yet another moniker (aka “TheScrollWheel” aka “JengaBob” aka “JustBob” aka “GoOverBoard,” and also other monikers on other sites, including “PenguinFan” and “InnerStuggleBob”). Here’s which sentence perfectly encapsulates your quaint (read: bigoted) views:
“That’s because you, like most Muslims, are supporters of Islamo-fascism.”
That came from some who supported the “Reconquista of Anatolia.” Oh, and this on about the coming jihadist takeover of America is also good.
“It will continue to be a free nation until Islamo-fascists take over and have their way.”
September 11th, 2011 at 9:25 pm
BTW, Robert Spencer took advantage of 9/11 by claiming that an ambiguous comment on Spencer Watch was death threat (again). Kinana the Clown then proceeded to copy/paste comments from a recent thread, falsely claiming that “Danios and LoonWatch” approved them all. Yet, one can see in the comments Kinana copy/pasted (no less!), Danios opposed calling Geller a “whore” etc.
September 11th, 2011 at 10:03 pm
yeah the hypocracy of jw is just amazing calling us psychotic when they themselves dance for joy whenever muslims are treated unfairly, delight in the prospect of nuking muslim holy cities and sit back and claim themselves to be freedom fighters even though there “hero” is friends with a known fascist, and denies the bosnian genocide ever happened(or was exaggerated), oh then there was the “tienemen square” thing one of there contributors suggested happen to people wanting a democracy in egypt, so yeah the people at jw are the sane ones its just insane standing up for peoples rights and not generalizing and entire religion for the actions of a few.
September 11th, 2011 at 10:19 pm
^ It seems that the post was actually the work of Marisol. Apparently the following comment was a death threat:
“Its time Robert Spencer got schooled–the hard way.”
The commentator who posted the above (over a year ago) then proceeded to link to a video purporting to refute anti-Islamic assertions. Even the loyal Robert Spencer fanboy Kinana of Khaybar concedes that it’s “ambigious” and “Not necessarily a threat or an incitement to violence.”
He then claims that Dr. M’s comments about a headstone on Geller’s plastic face “seem to get approved.” Later, it transforms from “seem” to “clearly approved by Danios and Loonwatch.” From “seem” to “clearly.” It clearly seems that Kinana is once again talking BS. Also, I don’t know if he’s claiming that every comment on LoonWatch needs to get “approved” or that LoonWatch approves of particular comments according to Kinana’s whims—wrong, in either case. Furthermore, this pathetic attempt by Marisol is exactly like one already thoroughly addressed on LoonWatch (see: Robert Spencer becomes desperate against LoonWatch).
Now let’s see what the loons have to say on the exact same thread.
First, a hallucination by Alarmed Pig Farmer:
“I just came back from the sacred waters of Lake Minnetonka, and what I saw was a vision of many speedboats driven by dudes in white skullcaps, their flowing robes flapping in the windy and water spray, partying down on the anniversary. Water skiing, too.”
It gets even scarier, with a quotation from Tabari:
“There are people who consider predestination untrue. Then they consider the Qur’an untrue…. People merely carry out what is a foregone conclusion, decided by predestination and written down by the Pen.”
???
Courreges eloquently expresses his thoughts in a single sentence:
“Bug off you Muslim pig.”
And Alarmed Pig Farmer again contributes to the conversation. This one’s my personal favorite:
“Moslems are like tiny, creepy ants, crawling from the anus of mankind’s corpus, threatening it if not with death by dehydration then permanent partial paralysis by unopposed ideology. This is the promise of Moslemism, and its constituent Moslems are working 24/7 to achieve their awful Cause.”
And then the usual conspiracies about CAIR, stealth jihad, evil brown people, and so on.
September 11th, 2011 at 10:27 pm
I’m with Farlowe here, I blame the leaders, not the foot sloggers who have to do the fighting. No person joins his or her military to kill people, in fact when I was going through recruitment in the UK they were very careful to weed out anyone with that sort of tendency (presumably referring them to the correct social service). For most enlisted personal, being a solider is a well paid job with good benefits and you get to learn a trade for when you leave, the same goes for most commissioned (especially when we have huge student loans!). I don’t really see anyone joining up to go and shoot ‘rag heads’.
And as the saying goes, the only true pacifist is a solider…
September 11th, 2011 at 10:31 pm
As much as I hate the US military being in Afghanistan under the false pretenses of saving the Afghans, I agree with the person who said that they are just following orders. There are fathers, sons, brothers and husbands that are losing lives, on both ends, for a war that has no purpose and no end in sight. It’s the warmongers in Pentagon and their Zionist pushers that need to be stopped.
Obama, bring our troops home!
September 11th, 2011 at 10:39 pm
@ Jack Cope:
the only true pacifist is a solider…
War is peace. Soldiers are pacifists. Couldn’t possibly get more Orwellian than that.
September 11th, 2011 at 11:17 pm
In my country we have a national holiday in memory of a military defeat: Gallipoli. The descendants of the Anzac soldiers who invaded Turkey gather together and march down the main street of most towns. More recently the immigrant descendants of the Turkish “enemy” soldiers who now live here march along with them. There is very much reverance attached to the memory of that battle and reverance for the current military personnel in this country, demonstrated by the fact that we have a national military holiday. Every year people gather for dawn services and a lot of young people go to Gallipoli for a memorial service. Well known Australian historian Manning Clark said : “The Anzac experience was “something too deep for words”.
The reality of war was expressed well by the last living WW1 Anzac before he died. Someone asked him what WW1 was like and he said something like “I don’t want to talk about it. It was horrible”.
September 12th, 2011 at 12:23 am
“I agree with the person who said that they are just following orders.”
That’s the worst possible defense for the actions of a soldier that can be said.
September 12th, 2011 at 12:31 am
I agree with most of the article, but I would like to stress that a lot of people join the army because they feel they don’t have much of a future anywhere else. If they come from poor families and neighborhoods, some of them will join because the army or navy will pay for them to attend college, etc. It doesn’t mean what they are doing is “right” or “good”, but if our entire societal system is designed to keep the low down and the high up, it is logical that some people with limited opportunities would serve such an occupation.
September 12th, 2011 at 12:42 am
How dare you talk about the elephant in the room, Danios!
It will take time, but I am convinced that more and more people will start to question this worship of Mars. War sucks. Sometimes it is necessary (though I don’t think that’s the case now), but it should never be glamorized and sanctified as some kind of holy rite. War is about “killing people and breaking things” as one old Marine told me once.
I do think it needs to be continually remembered that we have an all-volunteer military. Nobody is in today that didn’t join or re-enlist until after the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan. Even if you blame Bush for getting us in those wars or blame Obama for continuing them, each and every soldier, marine, airman and sailor today is a willing participant in these wars. If they didn’t believe in them, they shouldn’t have joined (or re-upped).
September 12th, 2011 at 1:29 am
“That’s the worst possible defense for the actions of a soldier that can be said.”
The soldiers don’t have a choice to not go to war if their leaders declare one. As Daniel said, people do have a choice to not sign up for military service which is perhaps the current trend for many people but it’s unfortunate that the conditions in USA have come to that and the blame rests only on those who run the country. I don’t think there is anything wrong to revere your military but because of the constant vilification of the Muslims 24/7 and because generally the American people are very gullible, the military and their families do think Islam is the enemy and that is what I have a problem with.
September 12th, 2011 at 1:58 am
The problem isn’t that the people worship or revere their military. Almost every country shows respect and adoration for the military, which they naturally see as representatives of their country’s might. Although probably not “worshipped” to the level of the US military, Turkish military is highly trusted and respected in Turkey.
The problem is that the majority of Americans do not really know much about the countries they are fighting. I was having a debate with someone from JW once, and we somehow got into music and I said I liked Iron Maiden. He replied (knowing that I was Turkish and lived in Dubaï) with something so stupid it made me laugh, something like “I wouldn’t be too vocal about your love for Western music in your countries if I were you”. He obviously didn’t know that I watched Iron Maiden live TWICE in Dubai…
I read somewhere that more than 80% of Americans do not have passports. Being a super-power, I can understand the lack of interest in the outside world because it does not affect their lives, unlike non-Americans or non-Europeans whose lives are affected by decisions of the US & EU. But it does make them ignorant, and the ignorant is always the easiest to convince that they are constantly in danger…
September 12th, 2011 at 2:09 am
Excellent article… May the victims of that day and the 100′s of 1000′s of victims who perish for it rest in peace.
But 9/11 has become a near worship cult, my TV is unplugged for the past 3 days as we are bombarded by it, even in my country. Sorry but to see U.S officials mourn the 3000 victims(may they rest in peace) while they’re still occupying two countries and doing much of the killing is ridiculous.
The most memorable phrase of the past 10YRS for many and full of clear warning to western muslims was by Bush.
‘Either you’re with us or against us’… meant for many muslims, either you will submit to us carpet bombing your fellow middle eastern muslims or you are a terrorist suspect.
September 12th, 2011 at 3:44 am
@Danios, sorry if I offended you, I ws just trying to explain how I feel. I hope it’s okay.
September 12th, 2011 at 4:08 am
I think there is shared culpability here between the politicians and the Armed Force. When politicians make decisions which throw an army into war or invading another country without ‘real’ justification, then we as a society should challenge this. Most soldiers join the Army because it provides secure employment and an opportunity to acquire a skill or a trade. However there is a large contingent whom join the Armed forces because they have bought into the illusion that its okay for America to kick ass and trample all over the world when ever it feels its interests are threatened or it seeks to advance its interests under some hidden Agenda that masquerades as patriotism.
Actually I am sick and tired of the whole thing, and for dick heads like bush to stand up and repeat the old mantra of we were attacked because of our freedoms, what bullshit! Its because of the occupation and America’s blind support of israel, nothing else. Sorry I am going off topic but this really gets on my goat! baaaa!
September 12th, 2011 at 4:33 am
I thought “Patriot Day” was April 19? The day Waco burned to the ground, according to the loons in self made “militias.”
September 11th is the National Day of Remembrance and Service by President Obama.
September 11th also marks the day of the War on Human Rights, as well as the phony-baloney War on Terrorism!
September 11th should be the International Day for the Fight for Human Rights!
September 12th, 2011 at 5:10 am
Elseporte, don’t forget that April 19th is a lot more significant to the US than Waco…think of what happened April 19th, 1775, “a shot heard ’round the world…”
September 12th, 2011 at 5:31 am
“The soldiers don’t have a choice to not go to war if their leaders declare one. As Daniel said, people do have a choice to not sign up for military service which is perhaps the current trend for many people but it’s unfortunate that the conditions in USA have come to that and the blame rests only on those who run the country. ”
All I’m saying is that “Following orders” is not a valid excuse for the morality of a soldier’s action, even if it doesn’t rest in them the choice of declaring war. While I disagree with much of Danios’ piece (and as much as I like Nassir’s posts, I chuckled when he called it “brave”) but I agree that there is a cognitive dissonance when someone is against the war but supports the troops.
September 12th, 2011 at 5:45 am
“War is peace. Soldiers are pacifists. Couldn’t possibly get more Orwellian than that.”
You missed the point entirely. Seeing your comrades or men under your command who you went through training with, effectively a member of your own family, bleeding out on some god forsaken rock because they were unlucky makes you pretty pacifistic when you get home, you never want to see war again. Same goes for seeing the ruins that your supposedly ‘clean’ and ‘surgical’ munitions leave behind them on some wretched city or the widows and orphans on both sides.
I think Farlowe’s story tells it well, I heard about the last Anzac and what he said, it is very very very true and many other veterans have repeated it. War is terrible, and I do think that computer games (yes yes yes, I know) have something to do with it as they make it seem both distant and unreal while at the same time making it entertainment. War has no pause screens and certainly has no save points…
Nothing Orwellian there, it’s just a fact. Once you see what war does you never ever want it to happen again to anyone. Frankly I think they should stick the politicians in some body armor, give them a rifle and see how they feel about declaring war after a week. Same goes for the likes of OBL, he never saw much conflict.
@Safak
Yearp, that is a common issue, many genuinely have no idea what the outside world is like, often no idea outside their small area that they live in. It’s a common problem around the world but it is defiantly far worse in the US than anywhere else. Ignorance I find is the root of all problems.
And those Iron Maiden concerts kept me up all night
September 12th, 2011 at 6:40 am
Another ‘Brave’ and controversial viewpoint?
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/09/2011910125513799497.html
September 12th, 2011 at 7:19 am
Nearly 3000 civilians were killed fy the followers of Mohammad who was also a TERRORIST number1He used to attack CIVILIANS of Non-Muslim tribess without declaration of war.His principle was:WAR IS DECEIT.Japan kill 1745 Americans at PEARL HARBOUR.That was unprovoked attack.This attack on 9/11 was also unprovoked attack on American soil by MUSLIMS.Pakistani Khaled Sheikh Mohammad was the main architect of the attack,instructed by Osama bin Laden and executed by mainly Saudi citizens and also finananced by some Saudi princed.Pakistan is the hub of TERRORISM.America should have NUKED those countries as it did to Japan.After that,Japanese have never attacked America again.Next time America should use the Nukes so that its citizens are never attacked again.People who defend the terrorist through LOON WATCH should be expelled before the penny drops.Any one who follows the footsteps of MOHAMMAD is a POTENTIAL TERRORIST.
September 12th, 2011 at 7:43 am
If only 2000 ISA military officials died on 9/11, would be call for celebrations indeed.
September 12th, 2011 at 10:04 am
^Celebrating anyone’s death is wrong…
September 12th, 2011 at 10:37 am
I liked the article. I want to comment very delicatly, not being from America, and sometimes on patriotic matters feel uncomfortable.
I think alot of the people who wage war have never seen it, and most of the people who have seen it…soldier, defender, or simply people caught between the combatants hate it.
War…if you have never seen it is a very ugly thing…the smells, sounds, sights…you never forget. I am an old woman…probably twice the age as most of you people here. I was born in a time and place where I thought as a child that war was what everyone did. I thought it was normal. I thought everyone was either a communist, or a nationalist…because that is the way it was then.
Anyone who has seen war who has a conscience and a humanity hate it. They dont want to be in a place where people want to kill them…but they want to go home the way they came. So they have been placed in a situation where they must defend themselves…and we must remember that when we talk about them.
We must understand that most soldiers are honourable people. If they were not placed in the situation…they would not do what they have to do to go home to thier families. We must have compassion and offer mercy to them.
However…those who sit in the leadership chairs…and those who sit behind computer stations dropping bombs from unmanned devices are like those who sit behind keyboards, wave the flags, hold up thier holy books and cheer the murder of others.
It doesnt take much to press a button, type hateful words, or spread propaganda or stand on a dias and live through someone elses bravery…for these are our cowards.
To me…there is a lower form of things that walk on 2 legs. They are, those who condone, encourage, or praise the killing of innocents, those stand in the blood of those innocents and promote themselves or thier ideology, and those who build over thier graves.
September 12th, 2011 at 10:50 am
Mossizle: Celebrating anyone’s death is wrong
Perseveranze posts at Ummah where if you are not a Muslim, you are a “dirty Kuffar”, where if you don’t support the “Taliban and the Mujahideen”, then you are a Munafik, etc. Hence, it is little wonder that he would make a stupid statement like that.
September 12th, 2011 at 11:06 am
@ Mindy:
You have nothing to apologize for.
September 12th, 2011 at 12:17 pm
Perseverance
If only 2000 ISA military officials died on 9/11, would be call for celebrations indeed.
Would you celebrate if they were those who played a hand in ending the Balkan conflict through Nato?
Would you celebrate if they included Muslims Americans?
I say the above, looking at it from your point of view, since you’re probably celebrating because they are enemies. Celebrating death is wrong, when Firoun’s men were being drowned in the parting of the sea, and the bani Israel celebrated, they were rebuked by God.
But the biggest flaw here, is that the US military can’t do anything without orders from the Commander in Chief. At the end of the day, in a democracy it’s the people who are responsible for the military since they elect their leader. The President and his cabinet are responsible for the military. The Generals only carry out orders.
You can only blame the military in a military rule.
September 13th, 2011 at 2:32 am
Danios, do you know why the US glorifies its military so much?
“Dulce et decorum est, pro patria mori.”
Same meaning said in English, drilled over and over for 10 years. Even a lie, when repeated enough, becomes the truth. In my opinion, it’s a very slippery slope of people who glorify “our boys” and the people who treat them with condescension as “death dealers”; finding a middle ground of “oppose the war and the politicians, help the returning soldiers cope” is much more difficult since the atmosphere of debate is always very highly charged.
September 13th, 2011 at 2:36 pm
As I said, I do not malign or vilify soldiers, nor encourage that.
But then you imply that the US military is responsible for “nearly 1,000,000 lives, the 10′s of millions of injuries, the infrastructural decimation in 3 countries…” These numbers are, by the way, completely made up but you feel the need to publish them in order to provoke an emotional response. Cheap shot.
At some point Loonwatch became less about defending Islam the Religion (Deen) and more about bashing America the Great Satan.
September 13th, 2011 at 2:42 pm
I do not support the people who do things like that, but I also read about a group of Marines and Navy corpsmen who helped arrange for a kid with a birth defect to get surgery here in the U.S.
Mindy makes an excellent point that Danios so callously dismisses. The US government and military give a tremendous amount of aid and charity to people all over the world including said countries. I would argue that the military does good everyday work on a far greater scale than aberrations during the fog of war like Fallujah.
September 13th, 2011 at 3:00 pm
Jim Kirk
The US government and military give a tremendous amount of aid and charity to people all over the world including said countries. I would argue that the military does good everyday work on a far greater scale than aberrations during the fog of war like Fallujah.
Dear Jim,
The US can give aid without military. The two are not connected. Please don’t pretend they are, it insults the common man or woman, of modest means who posesses no weapons, yet gives generously to charity.
September 14th, 2011 at 3:02 am
Isay every jew in occupied palestine is a soileder(yip right spelling) and they should be given their just desserts. What danios is saying also equally refers to the jewish occupiers.(note when muslims kill nobody says shia, sunni,etc, so in future all jews are jews in my eye, whether zionist, communist, atheist(hahaha like you can have an atheist jew))
September 14th, 2011 at 3:33 am
/\ I’m sure this dude is a shill sometimes, the writing is very ‘dirker dirker’ don’t you think?
September 14th, 2011 at 4:38 am
dead: Isay every jew in occupied palestine is a soileder(yip right spelling) and they should be given their just desserts.
Do you take medicine for your retardation?
September 14th, 2011 at 5:30 am
Jack
I think like you there are posters on this site playing a very strange game . I even think one of them is Bobby wtiting what he thinks an islamic extreemist would write just so he can complain about it .
Very tricky but then this is the web
September 14th, 2011 at 6:24 am
The US can give aid without military. The two are not connected. Please don’t pretend they are, it insults the common man or woman, of modest means who posesses no weapons, yet gives generously to charity.
When the earthquake hit Haiti, no one gave help like the US military. They saved many people. Everyday good people in the military do work that benefits the “common man or woman.”
September 14th, 2011 at 7:01 am
Jim
When the earthquake hit Haiti, no one gave help like the US military. They saved many people. Everyday good people in the military do work that benefits the “common man or woman.”
1. It was the politicians (President) who authorised the military to help Haiti.
2. Even if the US had not had a military, US aid organisations could have helped.
sorry, no dice
September 14th, 2011 at 7:03 am
bin dead for a while
Isay every jew in occupied palestine is a soileder(yip right spelling) and they should be given their just desserts. What danios is saying also equally refers to the jewish occupiers.( </i?
that applies equally to many countries, most of all the USA which killed native indians to occupy their land.
September 14th, 2011 at 8:32 am
1. It was the politicians (President) who authorised the military to help Haiti.
2. Even if the US had not had a military, US aid organisations could have helped.
sorry, no dice
You really have no idea what the military does, do you? Do you even know anybody in the military?
I think you’ve proved my point that Loonwatch (i.e. Danios) has fully demonized the US military, to such an extent that your views are so warped you can’t even acknowledge the basic good work done by soldiers, the vast majority of whom serve honorably.
September 17th, 2011 at 6:06 pm
Danios, this article hit it right on the nail.
I have read some of the comments that people have left on this article, and it only serves to confirm what you have said.
America does worship its military, that’s a fact.
I disagree with those who say you are demonizing the military, you are doing no such thing but simply putting the facts on the table.
In my opinion, I think it is utterly pathetic and ridiculous how America worships its army. An army is of course, necessary, such as for national border defense, but the military establishment in this country sometimes, as you said, and as I agree, analgous to the Catholic Church in Medieval Europe.
Anyone who brings out the facts like you did is automatically labeled such terms as “anti-american”, army-hater, someone who is warped because they hold and express views that are contrary to the men and women who “honorably serve our country.” Yourself, others who agree with us, and myself have all heard this crap before….
Again, good job on this article.
September 17th, 2011 at 6:16 pm
@Readers: Wanna bet $20 that Jim Kirk is Irshad Manjii, Asra Nomani, Zuhdi Jasser, or any other self-hating Muslim?
September 17th, 2011 at 8:27 pm
“Wanna bet $20 that Jim Kirk is Irshad Manjii, Asra Nomani, Zuhdi Jasser, or any other self-hating Muslim?”
Irshad Manji isn’t a self-hating Muslim. I think you’d be suprised how many conservative Republican cheerleaders there are among our self-appointed leaders and spokesmen in America. Not Nomani or Jasser, but people who are still held in high regard by Muslims. They will come out of the closet again when the time is right.