Ethnic Minorities Living in the UK Feel More British than White Britons

Categorized | Anti-Loons

Tags | Anti-Muslim, Britain, Institute for Social and Economic Research, Integration, Islam, Islamophobia, Muslims, UK, What if they were Muslim, White Britons

Ethnic Minorities Living in the UK Feel More British than White Britons

Posted on 02 July 2012 by Emperor

I’m not posting this to assuage those who are fearful of some mythical impending Muslim domination of Europe.

Instead I post this to ask a question; imagine if the results of this study had arrived at an opposite conclusion, that ethnic minorities, especially those of a Muslim background felt the least “British?” You can imagine the reaction that would follow in the looniverse.

This study does put a wrench in the anti-Muslim narrative of groups such as the EDL that try to question whether Muslims are integrated into British society (via. Islamophobia-Watch):

Ethnic minorities living in the UK feel more British than white Britons

Ethnic minorities living in the UK feel more British than their white counterparts, research has revealed.

Muslims are the most likely of all groups to identify with the concept of “Britishness”, the Institute for Social and Economic Research found.

The report’s authors say the results rubbish suggestions that ethnic groups are unwilling or unable to integrate into British society and show that fears over the negative impacts of immigration on cultural identity are overstated.

The study, named Understanding Society, looked at the socioeconomic circumstances of people living in 40,000 UK households.

Occupants were asked a series of questions, including how important, on a scale of one to 10, being British was to them.

People of Pakistani origin scored the highest with an average of 7.76. Bangladeshi and Indian groups came second and third respectively, while the White population scored the lowest with an average of 6.58.

The study also found that identification with Britishness was higher among the children and grandchildren of migrants.

The research will be presented next week at the Economic and Social Research Council research methods festival by Dr Alita Nandi.

She said: “There is a huge emphasis in public and policy discourse on immigration and its potential challenge to cultural homogeneity and national identity.

“Our research shows that people we might assume would feel very British in fact do not – while others who we might assume would not associate themselves with feelings of Britishness in fact do.”

She added: “Many people seem to manage dual identities, and it’s interesting to note that in all the ethnic groups we looked at British identity increases from generation to generation, while within the majority white population many maintain strong non-British identities, such as Scots or Welsh.”

Press Association, 30 June 2012

Sir David Illuminati membership number 16.69

Z A S
I thought all of the tracks on “egypt ” were about religion in one form or another . Although I am not a muslim I did recognise the word on the cover
Pity about the goings on in Mali, its a great place for music. I too wanted to go to the desert festival after seeing the Documentry of the great irish piper Paddy Keenan playing there. I fancied taking my instruments along with my partner and joining in the fun . I have played with some Berbers in the past great guys .
Lets us know if you restart your website
PS I dont mind the admin giving you my email so we can talk music off line and stop boring all the trolls
Zakariya Ali Sher

Most of the songs off Egypt are religious. I don’t have the complete lyrics in front of me right now, but I remember that there was one song thanking Cheikh Ahmadou Bamba and another praising the city of Touba (his birthplace, and the centre of Mouridism). Fun fact, apparently the album was originally to be called ‘الله,’ but was changed at the last minute for fears that westerners wouldn’t buy it. Never mind that the CD cover actually has ‘Allah’ written in gold lettering on it. Never mind that most people who listen to Youssou N’Dour are probably aware that he is West African.

Anyway, Tinariwen are good. My cousin and I have seen them many times. There’s actually been an explosion of Touareg music in the last few years, thanks in part to the popularity of Tinariwen. Terakaft, Tartit, Tamikrest, Bombino, Baly Othmani, Etran Finatawa (who mix Touareg with Peul music)… the list goes on. I’ve still got to pick up their most recent album, but in the meantime, I’m curious as to what the events in Mali mean for the Festival au désert, which was once one of the great venues for experiencing (and spreading) the music of the Touareg (and Songhaï, Mandé, etc).

Nusrat was great, and while nobody could ever live up to him, there are no shortage of great qawwali singers out there today. Abida Parveen, Sain Zahoor Ahmed, Mehr & Sher Ali, the Sabri Brothers and Nusrat’s nephew Rahat Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan are all good starts. For some rock with your qawwali check out the Mekaal Hasan Band. The German label Network Medien put out a deluxe packaged 2-CD tribute to Nusrat, featuring not only some of these qawwali singers but also artists such as Cheikh Lô, Alim Qasimov and his daughter Ferganah, the Kamkars, Munadjat Yulchieva, Sharam Nazeri & Dastan, and more. There’s no shortage of recordings of Nursat either, including some gems released through Asian labels. I’ve even come across a couple CDs of Nusrat singing Sikh devotional material.

And that’s only a small fraction of the ‘Muslim world.’ Culture Musical Club of Zanzibar epitomize the city’s taarab music, blending African, Arabic and Indian elements. Buda Musique has been releasing a decade spanning taarab anthology series called Zanzibara which explores both classics and forgotten gems. The Smithsonian has JUST finished a lavish 10-CD series exploring the music of Central Asia, in conjunction with the Aga Khan Trust for Culture. Each CD is sold individually, with the latest focusing on pipa-player Wu Man and a Tajik and Uyghur ensemble. In Egypt, El Tanbura has been exploring the hypnotic sounds of the simsimiyya, a lyre dating back to ancient Egypt. Metal has become the new sound of the Middle East, with bands like Nervecell (UAE), Bilocate (Jordan), Oath to Vanquish (Lebanon), Wyvern (Egypt), Creative Waste (Saudi Arabia), Orphaned Land (Israel), Thamud (UAE), Cragataska (Turkey) and Betzefer (Israel) amongst some of the better known. Iranian poet Mohsen Namjoo has been mixing Persian folk with rock and blues for a while now. Elef Records has put out some great albums like Lebanese singer Hanine backed by a Cuban orchestra, Tony Hanna and the Yugoslav Gypsy Orchestra, and traditional Palestinian music from the Chehade Brothers. Natacha Atlas has been returning to her Arabic roots, exploring the music of Muhammad Abdel-Wahhab, Oum Kalthoum and Farid al-Atrache on recent albums like Ana Hina, while Algerian singer Souad Massi released an acoustic CD.

Man… this has me wanting to restart my website with all the music reviews and cultural information on it. Believe me, I’ve only scratched the surface here…
Steve

I have seen Hawkwind many times, through various lineups, they always put on a good show.

I saw Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan at Glastonbury or WOMAD (I forget which) – I have no idea what he was singing about but what a voice and just beautiful music. I often think with some music not knowing the words helps, it’s more mysterious and the voice becomes another instrument.

Have you seen or heard Tinariwen, they are a tuareg-berber band from northern mali (if memory serves) – well worth checking out.
sir David

Well said Steve
Unfortunetly I never got to see nasrat Ali khan before his sad death although I used to have a tape of his , not a clue what he is talking about though. I suspect it’s quotes from the Quran or the hundred names of Allah. Anyone out there have an english translation of youssan N’Dour’s “Egypt” Album by the way I would be very interested in what he is saying.
I seem to have missed Slayer although I maybe could trump that with Hawkwind although they where very weird and just may have been on drugs , just a guess.

Sir David
Angers
Steve

“But you did say you don’t perceive these areas to be British, even though they are.”

Not quite, I said “many areas don’t look or feel how I perceive “british” to be, that’s not necessarily a bad thing.”

Of course they are british, they are in britain.

@Sir David, “Me I listern to traditional music from the UK and Eire plus I like a bit of african stuff too”

I like many forms of music, I like folk music, world music, rock music, dance music etc etc. I bet there aren’t many on here who have seen Nirvana as a support band in a pub, Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan, Ravi Shankar, Youssou N’Dour and Slayer
Sir David Illuminati membership number 16.69

Muslim Brit (and “steve “)
I agree with you Muslim Brit . What is Englishness ? Britishness ?
I remember Jack Straw, the then Home Sec getting grief for pointing out Chicken Tika Massala , was more commonly eaten in the UK than Roast Beef and Yorkshire Pud. Can you make Yorkshire Pud, Steve ?
I can and make Chicken Tikka Massala too but I need a tin of sauce for the latter , difficult to get here in france and dont start me on what the french call bread and flour .
Or is it music that defines British ?
The Beatles and Stones were all influenced by the blues from the deep south of the USA .What do you like Steve ?
Me I listern to traditional music from the UK and Eire plus I like a bit of african stuff too .
How British are you steve ?

I bet you wear or have worn pajamas now where did that word come from?

Sir David
Vice president
Leftwing Mooslim Alliance
West Anjou Branch
France

Donations gladfully accepted for the get Sarkosy out of jail , bail fund .
Muslim Brit

@Steve I wonder how big the “Little India/Pakistans” have to be for you to still feeling in a non British landscape?

Is it just one individual, one restaurant, one shopping parade, one cluster of extended families living close together etc?

British history is more than the “law of blood” for citizenship definition, so beloved for so long by places like Germany.

Britain’s history is far greater than that of the Little Englander scenario & the two are not the same. A vast trading empire saw huge transfers of population, ideas & culture, back & forth, creating the “Bastard” race in the sense of the poets of old.

Huge ghettos along docks have been commonplace, & some say even 8% of London was “Black” before modern immigration. Fish & chips, tea, coffee, curry & other commonplace items were the traffic of “Britishness”.

British history has many nuances & we often don’t realise the origins of foreign imports, as it becomes ubiquitous. Naturally the ethno-nationalist racist bigots are trying to undermine British identity in favour of English etc.
sir david

Steve
As someone who has worked in the immigration field I was amused by your comment that you thought immigration was ok as long as it was controlled and beneficial . this begs the question by whom should it be controlled and who should it benefit .
If you think the government and it’s minions at the home office control things well I would suggest you are in a minority of one in the UK. Every attempt the government has made since the 1960′s egged on by the Daily Mail et al has failed to control immigration as the Daily Mail would like.
Surprisingly people still want to come to the UK ,maybe freedom has it’s fans People are even free to be Muslim and read the Daily Mail.

Sir David
Angers
Skeptic

Well not a surprise as they will probably take over whites as the majority race in britain.
Géji

Steve Says: “Did they ask what “british” means? I am sure immigrants do feel british, they are british citizens but do they participate in britishness? Do the non-immigrants feel britishness has changed?

@Steve, granted, I’m not a ‘British’, I’m a Canadian. For certain (and I swear by Allah my maker when I’m stating this) as a Canadian, though I’ve live in this country since I was 11 years of age, I still cannot figure-out what being “Canadian” means (except maybe the love one is suppose to fell for his/her land). So, maybe (since you seem to imply you know the secret) its for you to define for us what it suppose to means being (whatever) “countryness”. So, since we’re speaking of Briton, what does it take thus according to you to “mean” British? and what is it supposed to look like when is to “participate in britishness” ?
JT

“You somehow took that to mean I am scared of them, you couldn’t be more wrong.”

Yeah, I know. I was being a little extreme on purpose, sorry. You should know from the previous conversations we’ve had that I don’t deliberately twist your words.

But you did say you don’t perceive these areas to be British, even though they are.
JT

The Contrarian,

You act like the polls you have found contradict those shown in the article above. They don’t. They refer to two different things. The last line you quoted in fact confirms these findings — “91 per cent still say they feel loyal to Britain”.

I’ll get to the Sharia bit later, but everything else you have quoted is not objectionable. 99% of Muslims thought 7/7 was wrong. No problem there. 1/5th support the motives behind the attacks — that means they support the reasons the terrorists cited in support of their attacks such as the Iraq War, Israel etc. Somehow the fact that 1/5th support these political objectives is the main news despite the fact that 4/5th do not. And I say, so what if 1/5th support the political objectives? They have made clear that these objections to foreign policy won’t turn violent, and they are free to hold the political views they want.

The manipulation of poll data to advance the idea that Muslims are a threat to Britain is very common, especially in the Daily Mail, The Sun and the Telegraph. Most often the headlines do not match the actual questions asked and even more often, they fail to compare these data to the general population. Let me give you an example. If 10% of Muslims support the killing of civilians, you would say that’s terrible. But what if 20% of the general population does as well — then that means Muslims are more peaceful than everyone else. Can you see how important the control data is in understanding the results of any poll?

Here’s the real-life situation:
http://www.loonwatch.com/2011/08/surveys-show-muslims-in-every-country-less-likely-to-justify-killing-civilians-than-americans-and-israelis/

So Muslims are in fact more peaceful. This is important to take into account whenever someone tells you that “X number of Muslims support terrorism”.

As for the Sharia issue, I don’t see what it is you are complaining about. You say that it’s perfectly legal, so what’s the deal if Muslims have Sharia arbitration courts to deal with their personal matters of wills, marriage and divorce just as Orthodox Jews use Beth Din courts. Only 40% actually want them.

None of what you’ve given can refute what the article above makes clear — Muslims are happy to identify as British, sometimes even more than White Britons.
Steve

“You said these areas don’t look or feel British according to you”

I said they don’t look or feel how I perceive british to be, I also said that’s not necessarily a bad thing. You somehow took that to mean I am scared of them, you couldn’t be more wrong.
JT

“I don’t recall ever saying otherwise”

You said these areas don’t look or feel British according to you. In my opinion, they are British. I didn’t apply a “knee jerk reaction”, I simply showed that what you thought wasn’t British was in fact British.
The Contrarian

How many people were polled and what is the name of the poll? According to two other polls 40% to 60% of British Muslims want Sharia even though discriminatory Sharia Courts are legally binding here in Britain due to the Arbitration Act.
“Four out of 10 British Muslims want sharia law introduced into parts of the country, a survey reveals today.
The ICM opinion poll also indicates that a fifth have sympathy with the “feelings and motives” of the suicide bombers who attacked London last July 7, killing 52 people, although 99 per cent thought the bombers were wrong to carry out the atrocity.

Overall, the findings depict a Muslim community becoming more radical and feeling more alienated from mainstream society, even though 91 per cent still say they feel loyal to Britain.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1510866/Poll-reveals-40pc-of-Muslims-want-sharia-law-in-UK.html
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/146
Steve

“ll the “Little Indias” and “Little Pakistans” that scare people like Steve, are British.”

I don’t recall ever saying otherwise and I don’t recall ever saying they scare me. I do wish people would read what it is I write rather than applying an instant knee jerk reaction based on their own prejudices.
JT

If the poll showed the opposite is true then people like Steve will say “Aha, I was right!”. But because this poll contradicts their beliefs, it ‘doesn’t prove anything’.

It’s not necessary to have to do exactly what the white population is doing to become British, because Britishness is not limited to the experience of the white population only. Anyone and anything that lives on this island is part of British culture and belongs here. All the “Little Indias” and “Little Pakistans” that scare people like Steve, are British.

They may appear South Asian, but if you were to transplant them into the subcontinent they would completely look out of place. The mix of cultures that you find in places like Southall are unique to Britain — they are British. Your perception of British culture is wrong, Steve.
DrM

stevie blunder said :

“but do they participate in britishness?”

What exactly is the definition of “britishness”? Lying face down marinating in a pool of your own vomit outside of a pub at 2AM?
Steve

Did they ask what “british” means? I am sure immigrants do feel british, they are british citizens but do they participate in britishness? Do the non-immigrants feel britishness has changed?

I am not against immigration at all as long as it is controlled and beneficial but I don’t feel this poll proves anything. I can go into my nearest city and many areas don’t look or feel how I perceive “british” to be, that’s not necessarily a bad thing.
mindy1

Aww that’s nice-glad that facts show up the loons
Hard Core Atheist

“Feeling more British” and “how important being British was to them” are two different things, no?